I loved this! I live in Northern California with 2 teenagers in the public school system. For lunch because there is no cafeteria to fit in all the students, they go across the street to Safeway, buy some crap and sit outside Safeway in hoards, even when it is pouring with rain. My son will often take his own lunch because we aren’t forking over money every day like a lot of the kids.
And then the phones, always on their phones at lunch. This is a huge issue as you all know. They are talking about implementing the pouches where each kid has to put their phone in a pouch which is locked by a teacher and unlocked at the end of the day. You will faint when I tell you the cost of implementing this…$200,000!!!!! An insane amount of money when programs are being cut from the budget and teachers are losing their jobs. And it won’t work since the kids find ways around it like putting a ‘burner phone’ in the pouch or using a magnet to open it. I don’t understand why the school can’t just say “no phones during school. If we see it we will take and then call your parents to come and pick it up.” Easy free solution!!! But no, they can’t because they are terrified of parents reaction, the outrage that their spoilt, entitled children can’t use Apple Pay to pay for their $20 pizza at lunch and they want to be able to get a hold of them throughout the day.
Oh I could go on and on. There is zero respect for teachers, the students run the asylum and it isn’t working. There is no accountability or recourse for bad behavior and everyone suffers. The teachers are burnt out and frustrated and have stopped caring and teaching. The kids don’t have boundaries and are always nervous to ask for help because the teachers don’t have the mental capacity to help.
My mother was French, went to school in Paris with a very similar schedule to your kids. I went to school in boarding school in the UK which is a whole other story but it worked. The teachers were thoughtful and were respected and there were consequences for rudeness, not getting homework finished, etc…we all knew where we stood, the balance was clear and we had to learn to problem solve by ourselves! Clearly I have thoughts….thanks for sharing your perspective, it’s important for people to understand that other countries have different values and processes around education which are much healthier for the schools and families. Oh and don’t get me started on guns…😞
Sorry, didn’t mean to write a whole post here. It touched a nerve in a good way and is probably something I need to write myself….although if any of the locals read it I may be run out of town as disloyal! 💜🇫🇷
Josephine, you need to write a post about this. Seriously. People need to hear these things! What you've just described - the Safeway lunches, the $200,000 pouch situation, kids running the asylum, the free obvious solution that can't be implemented because of parent pressure - is a complete picture of exactly how a system gets to where it is, told from the inside by someone actually living it. Your mother went to school in Paris, you went to school in the UK, your teenagers are in Northern California right now. There's definitely a piece in there. And I'd love to read it 💜
I will, for sure, it has been brewing. If I do, I may be run out of town and may join you in France. I am going through the motions of getting my French passport back so that I have options!
Kamille, this piece speaks volumes. I understand so, so much about what you’re revealing. I have felt utter dismay for several decades here, watching the dumbing down of American education. I have been equally grateful I have gotten my three degrees back when I was younger, and that I am 73 now and don’t have to grow up in these times in the US, and that I am not responsible to raise children here. What keeps coming to mind is an admonishment I read recently: Don’t prepare the road for your children; prepare your children for the road. We are failing in this country. France is succeeding, beautifully. Quelle incroyable!
Thank you, David! That admonishment is going to stay with me - prepare the children for the road, not the road for the children. It's the most precise possible diagnosis of where things went wrong and why the French approach produces such different results. Watching Sean navigate those years in Southern California and then seeing what our kids experience here is an ongoing education. Again, thank you for this, David. 73 years of watching it and still caring enough to say something clearly matters. 💛
Another fabulous post Kamille. A friend told me that this was maybe one of your best. I would concur.... but I am more of a romantic and get most carried away with turrets, meadows and wildflowers. However, this topic is one crying out to be addressed and good for you for having the courage, wit, and wisdom to speak out. Being American, the husband and father to teachers, I will raise my hand in agreement and empathy to what you and Sean have experienced. Children are spoiled and rude here and I will say terribly disadvantaged for it. I loved your ending with the four-second story about saying goodbye to your teacher. Somewhere along the way America has lost this.
The other topic you gently touch on is the cost difference in education. Europe has a different philosophy on this it seems.
The turrets and wildflowers are waiting for you, though there might be some different varieties blooming in August! I'm glad this one found its moment, too. Europe's position that education shouldn't be a financial catastrophe is so different from what we grew up treating as normal that it's almost hard to articulate. So glad you enjoyed the post 💙
I've lived in Ireland now for 13 years. Shortly after I first arrived, I walked by the local elementary school while some of the children were lined up outside to go for a walk (probably to the sea or the nearby playground/playpark). I heard a "hello, Susan!" as they approached: a 12 year old child I had just met. Each child - every one of them - said hello, most of them making eye contact with a smile (and some curiosity, of course!).
I recently was in the playpark with a 7 year old friend. A 16 year old neighbor walked by and I called out "hello!" He got off the sidewalk (footpath, here) came to the fence and chatted with us for a few minutes, specifically acknowledging the 7 year old and conversing with her. When I mentioned it to his Dad a few days later HE said "of course he did! I'd want to know if he hadn't!"
I was back in the States last month, visiting friends and staying in hotels. I met many young adults at a Miami Beach hostel I stayed in. Literally the only young people who sat and had conversations with each other were foreign tourists: British, French (struggling with English but still conversing), Argentinian. The Americans? TV and phones. Raised eyebrows in surprise when I'd say hello to them.
It seems it's "an American thing" in many ways, this rudeness or detachment of young people.
Wow, Susan, this is a fascinating story. Thirteen years in Ireland and you've been watching the same thing we've been watching here - teenagers who are just present, who say hello, who get off the footpath and come to the fence. And then Miami Beach as the control group. That contrast is so striking and so honest and the dad's response is everything. Thank you for sharing this. 💛
Thirty-two years, Mary Kaye! That is a long, generous run, and the fact that you can still say you adored the kids after all of it tells me everything about the kind of teacher you were. The crazy isn't the kids. We both know what the crazy is. Sounds like you left on a high note 💛
Thank you! And yes… I loved the kids, but had to leave before I lost my mind over things I knew weren’t going to improve.
I'm glad you and your hubby found your peaceful place. Mine is a little spot of ground here in rural Arkansas. It makes a world of difference when you find home. 💕
As an American, it's fascinating hearing about my French partner's academic experience... especially the lunches! He has completed two bachelors and masters degrees, and is now working on his PHD, something that would NEVER be possible in the US unless he was wealthy.
The PhD point is so important! Because it's not just about access to education, it's also about what kind of relationship you get to have with it. Pursuing a doctorate without debt is both financially and psychologically different. You can actually think. The lunches are the visible part but the university cost is the one that will shape your partner's whole professional life. 💛
There are a lot of differences and a lot of similarities btwn French and Italian schools. I found the discussion about avoiding holding kids back and teachers not having classroom authority shocking. In Italy, it’s expected that some teens will be held back, particularly in middle school and high school. This seems aligned with the “participation medals” for sport in the US. I’m not saying Italian schools are perfect, but I also don’t agree that kids should be passed forward if not aligned to the material. It can only help them to receive honest feedback and maybe find another program or school. I’ve seen it happen countless times here. Great piece!
Thank you, Lolly! And I agree with your point about honest feedback - it requires adults who are allowed to deliver it, which requires a system that trusts adults to make that call. Italy holding students back when necessary sounds like exactly that kind of trust in action. The participation medal parallel is perfect - same impulse, different arena, same long-term cost. Thank you for bringing the Italian angle in, it's a really useful comparison. 😊
So beautifully and succinctly put Kamille! I might write one comparing the systems between France and Singapore—we did afterall move here for our kids’ education.
You should absolutely write it. The France-Singapore comparison is one I'd find genuinely fascinating - two very different approaches to education, both taken seriously, both with real results. Your position having actually done it for that reason gives you something no amount of research could. Can't wait to read it 🙌
I enjoyed your article so much on the French school system. Like your husband, I taught a number of years in the public school system in Southern California so I really get the contrast between that and the French way.
As far as taking the Wednesday break, I started with a new dentist about five years ago and he always closes his office every Wednesday. Work two days, have a break, work two more days. I thought it was brilliant at the time and I still do.
A dentist who closes Wednesdays! Love that, Anitra. That's the American version of the French school calendar and I feel like it's working exactly the same way - built-in rest that isn't optional, and prioritizing life and family. So glad this resonated with someone who knew that classroom world from the inside. 💛
Coming from a university educator position in the USA to being a parent in Germany, I see so many of these same differences in on display at various levels of education and development. I'd offer the counterpoiny to your "let adults be adults" suggestion that one of the things the European systems do much better is to let children be children--not perfectly, of course, but a play based childhood without constantly accelerating standards is so, so, SO important! I'm certain that over-academizing was a root of much of the anxiety that my students brought with them to college.
The letting children be children point is such an important addition, and you're right that it connects directly to the adult authority question. I think a system that respects both gets the balance right, and in such a way that neither extreme manages. The anxiety your students brought to university is the downstream cost of removing childhood to accelerate academics and France is proof that you don't have to make that trade. Thank you for this perspective, Elsa. 💛
I am a teacher in CA and we are off from the beginning of June until the middle of August at my school. I think that is fairly standard in the US. We are required to have 180 school days.
Yes, that was the exact schedule my husband had. I think what struck us wasn't the summer length so much as the breaks-every-six-weeks structure, which Sean never had access to in seventeen years. The total days probably aren't that different. The distribution really is.
Exactly, JoAnn! The Wednesday reset is so simple it almost sounds gimmicky on paper, and then you live a year on it and realize you can't go back. Thursday genuinely feels like a fresh start instead of a forced march, and the kids come back to school as humans rather than husks. It costs the system almost nothing and changes everything. 🙌
Thoroughly enjoyed reading this! Everything is nuanced, but the education system as a whole in the US is quite alarming. A 4 or 5 course meal? A real break throughout the week?! Regular weeks off? Respect in the classroom? That is amazing.
It really is, Megan. A built-in pause halfway through the week, for everyone, and the four course meals - it's truly lovely. The cumulative effect is a system that treats childhood as a thing worth protecting rather than optimizing. Some of these aren't policies. They're just held standards, and they hold ☺️
I loved the gentle suggestions at the end for how to incorporate French standards into the American life. As a homeschooling mom, some of these are actually more obtainable for us! Taking Wednesdays off sounds like a lovely addition to try….
Awww thank you, Kate! The Wednesday experiment is definitely worth trying, and the beautiful thing about homeschooling is that you can actually run it and see what happens rather than just wishing the system would. It's actually my dream to homeschool my kids! I would love to have so much time with them 🌸
My husband also used to be a teacher and still works with educators directly — the strain you described on teachers in the US is very real. Really appreciated this thoughtful comparison, thank you!
Working with educators directly is a vantage point that allows you to see across many classrooms rather than inside just one. The strain Sean described wasn't unique to him or his district and the pattern being that consistent is pretty clear data. So glad the comparison landed as thoughtful rather than one-sided - that was the whole intention. Thank you, Samantha. 💛
Thank you so much, Denise. I care about getting the tone right on something like this - it's a sensitive topic and I wanted to be honest without being unfair. Really glad it landed that way for you 😊
I loved this! I live in Northern California with 2 teenagers in the public school system. For lunch because there is no cafeteria to fit in all the students, they go across the street to Safeway, buy some crap and sit outside Safeway in hoards, even when it is pouring with rain. My son will often take his own lunch because we aren’t forking over money every day like a lot of the kids.
And then the phones, always on their phones at lunch. This is a huge issue as you all know. They are talking about implementing the pouches where each kid has to put their phone in a pouch which is locked by a teacher and unlocked at the end of the day. You will faint when I tell you the cost of implementing this…$200,000!!!!! An insane amount of money when programs are being cut from the budget and teachers are losing their jobs. And it won’t work since the kids find ways around it like putting a ‘burner phone’ in the pouch or using a magnet to open it. I don’t understand why the school can’t just say “no phones during school. If we see it we will take and then call your parents to come and pick it up.” Easy free solution!!! But no, they can’t because they are terrified of parents reaction, the outrage that their spoilt, entitled children can’t use Apple Pay to pay for their $20 pizza at lunch and they want to be able to get a hold of them throughout the day.
Oh I could go on and on. There is zero respect for teachers, the students run the asylum and it isn’t working. There is no accountability or recourse for bad behavior and everyone suffers. The teachers are burnt out and frustrated and have stopped caring and teaching. The kids don’t have boundaries and are always nervous to ask for help because the teachers don’t have the mental capacity to help.
My mother was French, went to school in Paris with a very similar schedule to your kids. I went to school in boarding school in the UK which is a whole other story but it worked. The teachers were thoughtful and were respected and there were consequences for rudeness, not getting homework finished, etc…we all knew where we stood, the balance was clear and we had to learn to problem solve by ourselves! Clearly I have thoughts….thanks for sharing your perspective, it’s important for people to understand that other countries have different values and processes around education which are much healthier for the schools and families. Oh and don’t get me started on guns…😞
Sorry, didn’t mean to write a whole post here. It touched a nerve in a good way and is probably something I need to write myself….although if any of the locals read it I may be run out of town as disloyal! 💜🇫🇷
Josephine, you need to write a post about this. Seriously. People need to hear these things! What you've just described - the Safeway lunches, the $200,000 pouch situation, kids running the asylum, the free obvious solution that can't be implemented because of parent pressure - is a complete picture of exactly how a system gets to where it is, told from the inside by someone actually living it. Your mother went to school in Paris, you went to school in the UK, your teenagers are in Northern California right now. There's definitely a piece in there. And I'd love to read it 💜
I will, for sure, it has been brewing. If I do, I may be run out of town and may join you in France. I am going through the motions of getting my French passport back so that I have options!
Kamille, this piece speaks volumes. I understand so, so much about what you’re revealing. I have felt utter dismay for several decades here, watching the dumbing down of American education. I have been equally grateful I have gotten my three degrees back when I was younger, and that I am 73 now and don’t have to grow up in these times in the US, and that I am not responsible to raise children here. What keeps coming to mind is an admonishment I read recently: Don’t prepare the road for your children; prepare your children for the road. We are failing in this country. France is succeeding, beautifully. Quelle incroyable!
Thank you, David! That admonishment is going to stay with me - prepare the children for the road, not the road for the children. It's the most precise possible diagnosis of where things went wrong and why the French approach produces such different results. Watching Sean navigate those years in Southern California and then seeing what our kids experience here is an ongoing education. Again, thank you for this, David. 73 years of watching it and still caring enough to say something clearly matters. 💛
Another fabulous post Kamille. A friend told me that this was maybe one of your best. I would concur.... but I am more of a romantic and get most carried away with turrets, meadows and wildflowers. However, this topic is one crying out to be addressed and good for you for having the courage, wit, and wisdom to speak out. Being American, the husband and father to teachers, I will raise my hand in agreement and empathy to what you and Sean have experienced. Children are spoiled and rude here and I will say terribly disadvantaged for it. I loved your ending with the four-second story about saying goodbye to your teacher. Somewhere along the way America has lost this.
The other topic you gently touch on is the cost difference in education. Europe has a different philosophy on this it seems.
Enjoyed...
The turrets and wildflowers are waiting for you, though there might be some different varieties blooming in August! I'm glad this one found its moment, too. Europe's position that education shouldn't be a financial catastrophe is so different from what we grew up treating as normal that it's almost hard to articulate. So glad you enjoyed the post 💙
I've lived in Ireland now for 13 years. Shortly after I first arrived, I walked by the local elementary school while some of the children were lined up outside to go for a walk (probably to the sea or the nearby playground/playpark). I heard a "hello, Susan!" as they approached: a 12 year old child I had just met. Each child - every one of them - said hello, most of them making eye contact with a smile (and some curiosity, of course!).
I recently was in the playpark with a 7 year old friend. A 16 year old neighbor walked by and I called out "hello!" He got off the sidewalk (footpath, here) came to the fence and chatted with us for a few minutes, specifically acknowledging the 7 year old and conversing with her. When I mentioned it to his Dad a few days later HE said "of course he did! I'd want to know if he hadn't!"
I was back in the States last month, visiting friends and staying in hotels. I met many young adults at a Miami Beach hostel I stayed in. Literally the only young people who sat and had conversations with each other were foreign tourists: British, French (struggling with English but still conversing), Argentinian. The Americans? TV and phones. Raised eyebrows in surprise when I'd say hello to them.
It seems it's "an American thing" in many ways, this rudeness or detachment of young people.
SB
Wow, Susan, this is a fascinating story. Thirteen years in Ireland and you've been watching the same thing we've been watching here - teenagers who are just present, who say hello, who get off the footpath and come to the fence. And then Miami Beach as the control group. That contrast is so striking and so honest and the dad's response is everything. Thank you for sharing this. 💛
Sigh 😔
Too late for a do over
After 32 years of teaching in the USA, I took early retirement at the age of 54.
Absolutely adored the kids… all the crazy that goes along with the job though? Not so much. 🫤
Thirty-two years, Mary Kaye! That is a long, generous run, and the fact that you can still say you adored the kids after all of it tells me everything about the kind of teacher you were. The crazy isn't the kids. We both know what the crazy is. Sounds like you left on a high note 💛
Thank you! And yes… I loved the kids, but had to leave before I lost my mind over things I knew weren’t going to improve.
I'm glad you and your hubby found your peaceful place. Mine is a little spot of ground here in rural Arkansas. It makes a world of difference when you find home. 💕
As an American, it's fascinating hearing about my French partner's academic experience... especially the lunches! He has completed two bachelors and masters degrees, and is now working on his PHD, something that would NEVER be possible in the US unless he was wealthy.
The PhD point is so important! Because it's not just about access to education, it's also about what kind of relationship you get to have with it. Pursuing a doctorate without debt is both financially and psychologically different. You can actually think. The lunches are the visible part but the university cost is the one that will shape your partner's whole professional life. 💛
There are a lot of differences and a lot of similarities btwn French and Italian schools. I found the discussion about avoiding holding kids back and teachers not having classroom authority shocking. In Italy, it’s expected that some teens will be held back, particularly in middle school and high school. This seems aligned with the “participation medals” for sport in the US. I’m not saying Italian schools are perfect, but I also don’t agree that kids should be passed forward if not aligned to the material. It can only help them to receive honest feedback and maybe find another program or school. I’ve seen it happen countless times here. Great piece!
Thank you, Lolly! And I agree with your point about honest feedback - it requires adults who are allowed to deliver it, which requires a system that trusts adults to make that call. Italy holding students back when necessary sounds like exactly that kind of trust in action. The participation medal parallel is perfect - same impulse, different arena, same long-term cost. Thank you for bringing the Italian angle in, it's a really useful comparison. 😊
So beautifully and succinctly put Kamille! I might write one comparing the systems between France and Singapore—we did afterall move here for our kids’ education.
You should absolutely write it. The France-Singapore comparison is one I'd find genuinely fascinating - two very different approaches to education, both taken seriously, both with real results. Your position having actually done it for that reason gives you something no amount of research could. Can't wait to read it 🙌
hi Kamille
I enjoyed your article so much on the French school system. Like your husband, I taught a number of years in the public school system in Southern California so I really get the contrast between that and the French way.
As far as taking the Wednesday break, I started with a new dentist about five years ago and he always closes his office every Wednesday. Work two days, have a break, work two more days. I thought it was brilliant at the time and I still do.
A dentist who closes Wednesdays! Love that, Anitra. That's the American version of the French school calendar and I feel like it's working exactly the same way - built-in rest that isn't optional, and prioritizing life and family. So glad this resonated with someone who knew that classroom world from the inside. 💛
Coming from a university educator position in the USA to being a parent in Germany, I see so many of these same differences in on display at various levels of education and development. I'd offer the counterpoiny to your "let adults be adults" suggestion that one of the things the European systems do much better is to let children be children--not perfectly, of course, but a play based childhood without constantly accelerating standards is so, so, SO important! I'm certain that over-academizing was a root of much of the anxiety that my students brought with them to college.
The letting children be children point is such an important addition, and you're right that it connects directly to the adult authority question. I think a system that respects both gets the balance right, and in such a way that neither extreme manages. The anxiety your students brought to university is the downstream cost of removing childhood to accelerate academics and France is proof that you don't have to make that trade. Thank you for this perspective, Elsa. 💛
In Canada we have always had two full months of summer break, all of July and August. Is that considered generous in the US?
I am a teacher in CA and we are off from the beginning of June until the middle of August at my school. I think that is fairly standard in the US. We are required to have 180 school days.
Yes, that was the exact schedule my husband had. I think what struck us wasn't the summer length so much as the breaks-every-six-weeks structure, which Sean never had access to in seventeen years. The total days probably aren't that different. The distribution really is.
I love the idea of a break midweek. The Wednesday off would be amazing!! I think it would only benefit everyone.
Exactly, JoAnn! The Wednesday reset is so simple it almost sounds gimmicky on paper, and then you live a year on it and realize you can't go back. Thursday genuinely feels like a fresh start instead of a forced march, and the kids come back to school as humans rather than husks. It costs the system almost nothing and changes everything. 🙌
Thoroughly enjoyed reading this! Everything is nuanced, but the education system as a whole in the US is quite alarming. A 4 or 5 course meal? A real break throughout the week?! Regular weeks off? Respect in the classroom? That is amazing.
It really is, Megan. A built-in pause halfway through the week, for everyone, and the four course meals - it's truly lovely. The cumulative effect is a system that treats childhood as a thing worth protecting rather than optimizing. Some of these aren't policies. They're just held standards, and they hold ☺️
I loved the gentle suggestions at the end for how to incorporate French standards into the American life. As a homeschooling mom, some of these are actually more obtainable for us! Taking Wednesdays off sounds like a lovely addition to try….
Awww thank you, Kate! The Wednesday experiment is definitely worth trying, and the beautiful thing about homeschooling is that you can actually run it and see what happens rather than just wishing the system would. It's actually my dream to homeschool my kids! I would love to have so much time with them 🌸
My husband also used to be a teacher and still works with educators directly — the strain you described on teachers in the US is very real. Really appreciated this thoughtful comparison, thank you!
Working with educators directly is a vantage point that allows you to see across many classrooms rather than inside just one. The strain Sean described wasn't unique to him or his district and the pattern being that consistent is pretty clear data. So glad the comparison landed as thoughtful rather than one-sided - that was the whole intention. Thank you, Samantha. 💛
I’m enjoying your observations and what you and your family are gaining. Love your respectful and thoughtful words.
Thank you so much, Denise. I care about getting the tone right on something like this - it's a sensitive topic and I wanted to be honest without being unfair. Really glad it landed that way for you 😊